Carrying the Legacy Forward: Yuto Matsuura on Family, Precision, and the Future of Automation, Ep #23

[0:00] Nick Goellner: And it’s one thing for. The Matsuro family to know this, or the people who work for Matsuro or the Japanese people, but you need the world to understand it, and I just wanna commend you and say you’re having success. You’re on the Lights Out podcast. Thank you.

Everyone: This is all over LinkedIn.

Nick Goellner: I just wanna say U to humbly.

This is the third most important turning point of your life being

Yuto Matsuura: No.

Thank you for giving the opportunity.

Nick Goellner: Hey, what’s up guys? Eric, Dave, how’s it going? How you doing, Nick? Hey, everyone. Good to see. Doing good. We are, uh, all at our houses because we have a very special guest and he actually lives in the future. Um, he’s already in tomorrow. That’s how special he is. So I can’t wait for him to teach us about the future of manufacturing.

[1:00] We have Yuto Matsuura. Thank you. Uh, welcome to Lights Out. You are the, uh, director of matura, fourth generation, just like me, family business. Mm-hmm. So, uh, welcome to the show. Oh, thank you. My

pleasure. Thank you for inviting me.

So let me just start by, uh, the thing I think we can connect with the most.

Mm-hmm. Family business. I’m third generation of, of my business. My, uh, my grandfather, uh, immigrated to the United States and started our company and it was a, it was a small company, it was a struggle for us. Mm-hmm. Um, father turned it a much larger company. I was told. The third generation ruins everything and everything falls apart in the third generation.

So, um, congratulations to making it through the fourth generation. Happy number four.

[2:00] Yuto Matsuura: Yeah. Actually, my father always say the same thing. The third generation is supposed to, you know. Make it end. But you know the downside of the fourth gener Yes. In, but the third generation is somehow sold their grandfather working so hard, right.

That the founders work. But as a fourth generation, I never get to chance to see him, you know, working. So that’s a Hmm. Downside of being frustration. Anyway, I, I get a lot of the same thing from many, many people, even first generation, maybe you, you, you will not understand how much work and the effort was made during the competition.

Oh my gosh. Anyway, that’s the life we living. Yeah.

Nick Goellner: Yeah. So you, you get it completely. Let’s start with, uh, your story. Let’s go all.

[3:00] Your story. Mm-hmm. And then maybe you can, as you tell your story, give us a little bit of the history of Matura the entire business, but mm-hmm. Were, were you aware that I’m going to work for Matura, this will be my career, I will work for the machine tool business? Mm-hmm. Or was it kind of up to you?

Yuto Matsuura: Okay.

You know, many people ask me this question. It’s kind of long story. So I always answer when I was, when I was a kid, my father brainwashed me, but instead of that, I like to give you true story. So I guess the whole many people around me, it was always assume that I would join the family business from the moment I was born because I was the first born in the family and I am male.

[4:00] And uh, so there were suddenly expectations that. Based on me from an early age as a child, I felt a mix of pride in my family and also the concern about the weight of those expectations. And as I got older, I started to understand what it takes to be strong leader and how intelligent and capable person I need to be to succeed in international business.

And how wide. Gap between who I was and who I needed to become. So this concern only grew stronger during my teenage years. Under, eventually, when I was 15 years old, I had to make a decision. But that was the year, the great recession in Japan.

Mm-hmm.

Yuto Matsuura: So, uh, and our, our company was impacted severe as well.

[5:00] I think our annual sales dropped to 30% of what they normally were. So it, it was a crisis. But kazu, so my, my father Kazu, he, his sonar opportunity in it because the company’s body had temporary degrees, so he thought it might be good time to transfer some shares to next generation in this way. It would help us avoid a huge tax burden as well.

But before moving forward. Smart guy. Yeah, smart guy. So he wanted to be, he wanted to be sure if I was committed, so that I would not change my mind later. Right. Yeah. So that, that’s

Nick Goellner: why he asked. So that’s why 15 was when you had to make the decision, like, do do I want to take ownership of this business?

Exactly. Obviously like transferring equity ownership in that regard, but also owning it. Internally in your heart, does this, do you do I wanna commit to this. 15 is pretty young. That’s pretty amazing.

Eric Nekich: I, I, yeah. Hat’s off to you. I had no, I would’ve no clue. At 15. Yeah.

Nick Goellner: Eric, your, your son is, uh, 14, Jack, right?

He’s 14. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

[6:00] Eric Nekich: Could you imagine that? Like, I don’t think he’s, it’s summer break. He probably hasn’t put pants on all day, you know, let alone just tonight what? You had to decide,

Dave Vuyk: you know,

Nick Goellner: Dave, how old’s your oldest? I know you got like 17 kids, but

Dave Vuyk: Yeah. Not quite 17, but, uh, she’s nine. Um, but yeah, it’s uh, I mean, 15 years old.

I mean, you’re, you’re just figuring life out at that point, much less considering what you’re. Professional life is going to look like, uh, into adulthood. That’s, that’s quite something. Yeah.

Nick Goellner: So Uto, take us back to exactly what you were feeling at 15 when your father asked you, okay. Is mm-hmm. Should I transfer ownership to you?

Is this a burden that you want to carry?

[7:00] Yuto Matsuura: Yeah, that’s what exactly asked me. Under, of course, he gave me explanation that shares the body of the corporation and we can avoid the tax. Of course, as 15 years old, I didn’t have any understanding. But in the end I said, yes, I will join the business. When you, you guys said all the nice thing about me deciding or me deciding to join the business when I was young, but it was not like that.

I, I said I will join the business, but it was not because I wanted to. I, I, it was more like, because I felt I had to. So I felt, when I was young, I always felt their expectations, pictures for many people, and I did not want to upset or disappoint those people who thought I would take care of this business in the future.

And at that time, I didn’t have any other career, career plans, so that that’s how I made my decisions.

Nick Goellner: So you felt more, would it be safe to say it felt more like an obligation? Like you, you had to do it to carry on the legacy?

Yuto Matsuura: Exactly.

Nick Goellner: But you didn’t necessarily wake up dreaming about machine tools and excited about making things out of metal and everything that I see on LinkedIn today?

[8:00] Yuto Matsuura: No. So actually Hudson, my father, when he was young, he was different. So his grandfather took him to the factory under, you know, exposure has started when he was a, you know, kid. But because of his experience and he didn’t want me to feel the same pressure. I when I was a kid, so it, it was, of course, I was, you know, taking, I was, I got opportunity to sometimes visit my, you know, factory, I mean their mat factories.

But I never understood what was going on. So that was a moment he asked me to give Christian, and honestly, I had no idea what machine two industry was at the time. Yeah. That, that’s why you work.

Nick Goellner: It’s, it’s similar to my life. I would have to, so here’s what I remember you do. Mm-hmm. I would be sitting in the backseat of my father’s car and he would make about.

[9:00] 13 to 15 phone calls in a mm-hmm. Half hour period. Checking with all of his managers, everyone who was running a different department, and I was just hoping I would get to my soccer game on time, you know, so it was just like hearing it all, but, and that I would go to the company and I would see the machines, but I had no idea, like mm-hmm.

Everything that. Came with the family business. It was, it wasn’t until my early twenties mm-hmm. That I, I mean, I, I used to work in the shop when I was a teenager, but it wasn’t until my early twenties that I really felt like, mm-hmm, okay, this, this is gonna be our burden. Mm-hmm. If we accept it. But my mother was always telling my father.

You know, as the second generation, he didn’t feel like he had a choice, really. Mm-hmm. It was already decided for him, and my mom was like, you can’t do that to our kids. Mm-hmm. They should be able to choose whatever they want. So he was careful to s. To, you know, if we had to ask, we had to say, Hey dad, should we come into the business?

[10:00] So it was, it was maybe a bit different for me. But was it like that for you? Was, was it expected or was it you could do whatever you want? You tell it’s totally your decision. Um, let, just let me know, was it expected or was it a, you tell me

Yuto Matsuura: type situation. Okay, so I think my. Parents didn’t specifically talk about it.

My futures. Yeah. They were like, okay, it’s your choice. You can do whatever you want. But okay. Many people around me, like even neighbors, my classmates, my relatives, they always say, oh, you will, you will fill you bigger shoes. You will take, uh, responsibility to take your business. For example, you, you do find survey in your school, right?

[11:00] Like food is most likely to be successful. Food is most likely to be active. Right. Yes. Doesn’t make sense. Absolutely. Yeah. And I, I, I was always not wearing who is most likely to be successful, like to be the mo rich person, because everyone knows I’m involving family business. The funny thing is that sure, there is, there is another girl who is also in the top of the list who is most likely to be successful.

But the reason why she got in the list words, because there is a rumor that she liked me, she was most likely to be my future wife. So that’s why many people voted her.

Everyone: So I, yes.

Yuto Matsuura: So I think this story can tell you how much, how many people expect me to be there next president, right? Yeah. So instead of that, I think my parents.

Probably are one more careful about it, so that I wouldn’t feel the pressure.

Eric Nekich: I thought you were gonna say you were voted most likely to work at Matsuura.

Yuto Matsuura: There is no number two. Probably my brother. Yeah.

Yeah,

Nick Goellner: yeah. We should ask about that. Do you have siblings that are involved in the business? Brothers and sisters?

[12:00] Yuto Matsuura: No. So I have my, I have one younger brother and uh, he’s working out there, um, bank in Japan. Uh, sour. We don’t have any plan to bring him in that were, that is my father’s policy.

So,

yeah,

Yuto Matsuura: in the second generation time, there are, of course, the president was my grandfather, but there are like brothers and the cousins. And, uh, as a south generation, my father saw a kinder issue in this organization structure because employees have had to show respects to president and president brothers, and sometimes the decision making is very complicated.

So he thought it would be good for, you know, family business to just choose one, you know, family member to take of the business. Of course, I can get along with my brother. I’m suffering from a shortage of people, I can just ask him to join us. Right. But, uh, yeah.

Yeah.

[13:00] Yuto Matsuura: But I, I really give them a serious consideration and I, I came to conclusion that I cannot guarantee their future, like, uh, next generation, next generation cousins, they might fight each other.

Right. And it could be ugly. So I kind of, okay. As long as everyone thinks I’m doing okay. I’m doing okay. So that’s why KA and he calls my brother beat. So if I fail,

Nick Goellner: that’s an awesome nickname. That’s great. That’s beautiful. So I have a few more questions for you and then I know Dave and Eric have have a few questions, but I just love the story because I can relate to it from the other side of the world. The um. Okay, you’re at 15, made this decision. It’s because everyones you to, it’s at that.

[14:00] Did you feel at any point in your life this start to change? Where, okay, now I have a fire in my heart. Now I have a passion. Mm-hmm. This is my, this is exciting and it, I think about it when I’m in the shower and when I’m dreaming at night and, you know, the way it is for me. Did that start to happen to you?

And when did that happen?

Yuto Matsuura: Okay, so, so I, I told you the story, so despite everyone’s expectation, I, I didn’t feel much pressure at first. But instead, I simply thought, I need to be capable enough to run this business well under. You know, I imagined how miserable it would be to see employees who disappointed in me, so that that fear at least motivated me to study hard When I was a student, after I made the decision to join the family business, my career path started to take shape.

[15:00] Katsu gave me a list of universities that he hoped that I would attend, and time to time he took me along on some of his international business trips and, but the biggest mission he gave me was to get my master degree somewhere in the North America. I ended up studying in Canada, but it was not just to get it, but it was to finish it in one year, though.

It was a huge challenge for someone like me who was born and raised in Japan. Eventually I gave everything I had and I made that happen. You got

Nick Goellner: your master’s degree in one year? In one year

and

Nick Goellner: I So you had a, you had a bachelor’s degree in Japan? Yes. And you came to Canada and you got your master’s degree in basically one year.

It’s usually at least two years.

Yuto Matsuura: Yes. That’s incredible. So you were

Nick Goellner: in class all the time.

[16:00] Yuto Matsuura: Yeah. So, you know, I, I would say that was the most challenging because that’s education and the college, university system is very different from Japan. So I was so surprised that, so at least, like I, if I finish 10 courses per year, basically I can get a master degree in one year.

That’s how it, you know, worked. But if I fail one course past semester. Probably that will be end. And uh, if I fail two, two courses, I’ll be ticked automatically. So there was so much pressure like removed from

Nick Goellner: school.

Yuto Matsuura: Exactly. All the way

Nick Goellner: if you fail twice. Oh, I drop out. I would’ve been removed from school many times because I, I, I failed calculus so many times.

I had to rearrange how I did college so I could get a degree without having to pass count. So Dave. Did you go to college in Canada?

Dave Vuyk: Yeah. Although so. Oh, okay. So you know you went to the University of Toronto, correct? Yes. Yeah, I’m in the Toronto area, so that’s uh Oh, okay. So cool. Um, I didn’t go to the University of Toronto.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I went to, uh, the, the community college. Mm-hmm. But, uh, that’s a such a small world. Interesting.

[17:00] Nick Goellner: Okay, so, so you, you studied very hard, you achieved your master’s degree in only one year? Mm-hmm. And then what was the study? What, what was your, um, degree

Yuto Matsuura: in? So my major was mechanical engineering.

I always liked, you know, engineering stuff. So my bachelor degree was also in engineering, and of course cut. Thought it should be either of engineering or finance. I chose engineering because that’s what I liked. Uh, yeah. Anyway, so I, I, I, I would like to continue the story, so yeah, I made that happen. Then that experience gave me, you know, real tense of confidence and, uh, from that moment on, I, I thought I became completely different person.

[18:00] But along the way I also came to realization that the opportunity and the support I had were not things I earned by myself. I was incredibly lucky to be born into this family, but when I was small now into Canada, I was not totally alone. Many people treated me like, uh, their own family. There were all the friends and the business partners of my family and also they gave me a good support and make sure I was, I survive.

And also they told me a very touching stories about my family, especially my grandfather, that, I don’t want to sound arrogant, but it seemed my grandfather under deep respect from many of them, even though he didn’t speak English well. I guess he, you know, gave everything he had. He earned their trust.

[19:00] Then he built a relationship, right? So I guess, sir, but he made a lot of sacrifices. He made a lot of hard work, even through a tough times so that the future generation could have better education that he couldn’t have and have a better life. I was the one who benefited all. And also of course I was, and I am spoiled in many ways, but the real inheritance was not the money or asset, it was the people and the relationship my family has built.

And thanks to that legacy, I grew up surrounded by support and I have experience most people never get to have. And uh, yeah. But. Suddenly my grandfather passed away while I was in Canada. So when that happened, I asked myself what call, what did I ever give back to him? I knew he always dreamed of like traveling to Europe together and he always said, I want to play golf with you Utah in some day.

[20:00] And I never made up any, I never made any of that happen. And then he’s gone. And that’s kind of when I made a promise to myself. I will give my everything to my family business. That will be my way of honoring him under his legacy he left behind. But that was sure in the turning point, you know, because when I made decision, when my father asked me that question, I was not motivated.

But that moment changed my mindset. And, uh, of course, you know, since then, like many things have happened, like, especially after I started working at Matura, there were, uh, millions of times I wanted to quit. Just as many times I stood back out and I came back to the office. But the moment when I was a student that that experience was sure leader, you know, the moment that when my family business became my passion.

Nick Goellner: Wow. Geez. I wasn’t ready for that story. You got me all choked up. It’s a great story. Yeah, of course. I made that up. Just,

[21:00] oh man. The, the. The parallels are, are still there. My grandfather’s 94. He’s still around. I see. But he has an incredible story of just what he went through and mm-hmm. Yeah. I know. I’ll have that feeling someday when he’s not around. Mm-hmm. That that’s what we can give back. Because same thing, he, he gave everything for us and he built this, he started this business and he, he went through a lot of really hard times and, um, yeah.

Yeah. It’s funny. He never really gave me a lot, he didn’t hang out with me a a ton. He, you know, he was, he was never liked. Giving us money or gifts. But what he always did is he put energy and finances towards our education. Mm-hmm. Because to him that was the most important thing. And when I hear you say that the, the, you know, sending you to Canada and the relationships and, and the legacy, how everybody talked about your grandfather mm-hmm.

That’s really what he left you. Mm-hmm. I totally can connect with that. Mm-hmm. It’s, it’s amazing. Thank you. Okay. Well now that I have, uh, tears in my eyes, I’ll ask you my last question and then we can move on to the other guys. Great job.

Eric Nekich: You know, so you got ‘

[22:00] Nick Goellner: em.

Yuto Matsuura: I got any,

Nick Goellner: so, you know, you know, a thing or two about making chips?

That’s the, that’s the main show under our group. Mm-hmm. And then this show Lights out mm-hmm. Is all about, um. Automation mm-hmm. And technology and running the shop lights out, you know? Mm-hmm. You’re, you’re at home resting and your shop is making you money. And so when you think of different machine tool companies, machine tool builders, there’s only so many that you automatically think about automation.

Mm-hmm.

Nick Goellner: And Matt, sir, is at the top of that list for me. Thank you. You have, your business has a, a great reputation for incredible automation with your machines. Mm-hmm. What do you think is the reason for that? Why? Why are your you so strong when it comes to automation as a brand and as a business?

Yuto Matsuura: Hmm, interesting.

[23:00] So I think we’ve been a ion in this type of solution, which is a five boxes and part and the prioritized solution. So the first model came out into the market in early nineties, so we always try to be ahead of others. By making there something that never existed, so. Mm-hmm. I think the main, the main reason was either we did it first and uh, I think because their concept of a five access and a product pool is just a machine specification.

That means if we can copy that, in my opinion, okay. Mm-hmm. Everyone can make their five boxes and put their pallet changers on the log tool marketing together, and then package them. But I think what what makes us unique is the build quality. So our machine solutions design solution concept is how you can eliminate switching time and cost between different jobs.

[24:00] So of course, and while you keep your spin up and running, so of course sir, you can keep your fixtures while holding and the tools selections in your machine and. Ideally you get 30 repeat orders. You put the material, you press the button, you go home. But next morning you find out tolerance is out off little bit.

You tweak and you do make adjustment. You make it again. That doesn’t make sense. So true automation is really based on the build quality and you can never understand the difference looking at the brochure because the brochure tells you, okay, this is a work envelope. This is how I create, because it has a linear skills or whatever.

[25:00] But what we do in our manufacturing is very different. So we do, we still do the hand scraping to ensure the highest precision. And even when we amount our linear guideway, we always make sure that strain is under, is within two microns. So this little pairs and the detail makes us different and make our machines reliable.

So I think that of course. When we came in early nineties, we came up with this idea five access automation. This is automation for a high mixed, low volume manufacturing environment. But at the same time we had, we made sure the machine is reliable enough to ensure their precision accuracy will be always there.

Does that make sense?

Nick Goellner: Yeah, no, that makes sense. Absolutely. Look, I think it makes perfect sense to me. Lemme say it back to you and you tell me if I nailed it. So if, if you have 40 pallets, 60 pallets attached to a five excess mill and you’re trusting it to make the same part with or, or a variety of parts with the exact precision over the life of that weekend or that entire, uh.

[26:00] Unattended cycle. It really comes down to the quality of the machine tool itself, because once things start to drift out of tolerance, if you can’t ca catch it mm-hmm. Then you’re going to automate scrap, you’re gonna automate parts that don’t meet the quality standard. Mm-hmm. And so what I heard from your response is our machines are built so.

Precisely and so durably and so, um, you can trust the machine so much that that’s why we have this reputation for five access machine tools with pallet automation.

Eric Nekich: Yeah, absolutely. Did

Nick Goellner: I capture that? Yeah. Okay,

Yuto Matsuura: perfect. Thank you.

Eric Nekich: On the Lights Out podcast we’ve talked about. For weeks now, right? Process reliability.

You cannot automate something that’s unreliable. And it sounds like you build that right into your machine tools, right into your pallet pool, repeatability and precision. And that’s the cornerstone, right? Mm-hmm.

Nick Goellner: And isn’t that what we just saw, Eric? I mean, we talked about it on the episode we recorded last time, so you took, we were, I was sending you photos from Switzerland.

[27:00] We were with one of our partners. Mm-hmm. Uh, Swiss Modular Triag, and I was asking, uh, the owner. Mm-hmm. I said that that machine right there, how often does it run unattended? How often does it run through the night? And he said six days a week for the last 15 years. Well.

Yeah. They’re, they’re, it, it’s, it’s a mam machine. Yeah, exactly. One of your machines. And I was like, so how many times have you had to change out the spindles? And he said, none. We don’t crash the machine. So good on, good on them. They, they have good programmers and they don’t crash the machine. But I was blown away by his answer.

I was thinking like, yeah, yeah, this one usually runs 80% of the time, or something like that. But it, I, I was just totally blown away by it. So.

[28:00] Eric Nekich: I think one of the things that, that, that speaks to this too, is just talking to some of your partners here in America, uh, Utah, and learning how rare it is for like an MX three 30 or like mm-hmm.

Uh, is it the five 50 to be sold without a pallet pool? Like it, it’s extremely rare. I mean, a high, high percentage of those sales are purchased with that automation right away. Right.

Yuto Matsuura: Exactly. So because we are manufacturer, we all know like what kind of breakdown we have. So I would say 85% of our cells comes from this type over chains package.

Yeah.

Nick Goellner: 85% of your five Xs mills are sold with the palate chamber.

Yuto Matsuura: Right. So we offer price change option for our five boxes on our horizontal machines. Combining these two 85%, probably little bit. Yeah. Yeah. 80, almost 10. 85. Only for five xxi. Yes.

Eric Nekich: That’s

Nick Goellner: very, very impressive. That’s what I see whenever I, anyone, yeah, that’s extreme.

Yeah.

[29:00] Dave Vuyk: Whenever I hear the name mat, I’m reminded of a, a local shop, and their challenge was they were very much limited on floor space, which put a ceiling on, on what they could produce in their shop. And they had a lot of conventional vertical and floor axis machining centers and they ended up. Buying one MX three 30.

And then that went so well, they bought two more MX three thirties and got rid of the rest of the machines, and they’re just running those. And the increase in the volume of work they could produce. Um, and, and it really allowed them to double down into making satellite components. It just completely transform their business.

[30:00] Um, which, you know, it’s a remarkable story. I’m sure that’s one of. Many, um, you know, you’ve, matsu has probably had that impact on a lot of shops. So, you know, a question I had for you, and, and this probably comes a little bit on the heels of, of what Nick was asking about, but mm-hmm. You know, when you’re advising machine shops who want to kind of embark on that automation journey.

What would you say is kinda the first step or, or, or one of the most important steps to get? Right? Um, is it, is it a little bit into what you’re talking about with build quality and, and choosing a technology partner that’s gonna give you that process reliability? Uh, or are there other elements that people often don’t think about?

Yuto Matsuura: Okay, so I like to talk about their high boxes with the pilot changers. So because this is our main product and the main solution under. I like to answer this question by, uh, like explaining like there is a type of people who hesitate to invest in this kind of solution. Okay. So I think mm-hmm. Everyone agrees that the auto automation is a way forward, but there, there are some people hesitating in inner, uh, five oxy machines.

[31:00] So I like to talk about specific five Oxy side. They believe it’s overkill for, uh, their current job mix. So their concern is that they don’t have many parts that require five access application, but they still want automation. So they then they go, I need three cheap, cheap three X mode with a bunch of parts.

That should be enough because we really do five access machines. But I believe that this. Even this type of manufacturer should seriously consider five a machine. I think this is the start. So, so the real power of prioritized five A is not the cutting complex geometries, but it is about their automation capability and the flexibility in high mix, low end environment.

[32:00] So most modular users don’t just use their five boxes for ultra high-end components. They use it for indexing the multi, you know, face machining, which allow them to ma um, cut as many parts of the part without monitor intubation. So basically they’re doing three access works, but without flipping the part by hand.

But this is not complicated at all. But this will, that’s the cause.

It’s very simple way, but it’s not, and it, it’s very simple and it makes a huge difference. It eliminates minor intervention and maximizes tku. Time per apart. This means it’s easier for you to schedule your lights out operation, easier to keep your spindle up and running. So under. We are the party changer.

Thank you so much for saying that. That’s

Dave Vuyk: such a, that is such a great point. Um, it made Dave’s year.

[33:00] Nick Goellner: Yeah. So we just bought our first five access machine and we had some guys at our company who were like, we don’t do five access parts. And they’re looking at like turbine blades mm-hmm. And bliss and this, and it’s like, that’s not why you get a five access machine.

Yeah, that’s right.

Dave Vuyk: Yeah. And so, I mean making like the best use of the technology that’s available to you and not overcomplicating it. And, you know, another question I had wanna ask you was like, what separates the people that are successful with automation from the people that aren’t successful with automation?

And I think you kind of touched on it there, right? There’s a, there’s a mindset thing there where, you know, you have to be kind of open-minded to, um. Making use of the technology for the work that you have, right? Mm-hmm. It’s like, yes, you’ve been doing it this way for years on your three axis machine doing multiple setups, but that’s not gonna allow you to go the next 10 years.

[34:00] You know? You, you need to be more competitive. You need to work smarter, not harder. Mm-hmm. Right? If, if we can figure out how to do 10 hours of work in eight hours, one of two things, either. We can do more work, uh, or we have those two hours saved. We can go home, we can see our kids, spend time with our families, go on a vacation.

But either, either outcome, either path you choose. That’s so much better.

Nick Goellner: Well, and we just talked about, um, our partner in Switzerland, they run one eight hour shift and they get almost 24 hours of machining every day. So it’s not just 10, 10 hours of working eight hours. It’s a whole day in one shift.

Exactly. So

Dave Vuyk: impressive. Mm-hmm.

Nick Goellner: Okay. So Utah, do you see people fail with automation? Who, who are, who say, Hey, we tried to automatically load the machine and it, that just doesn’t work for me? Mm. Do. Do you see that or not so often?

Yuto Matsuura: Well, not so often, but of course sometimes I miss the touchier people. I think there are two milestones.

[35:00] Milestone one was there. The thing I talked about, they have to realize that private access is not just a niche solution from complex work. They do a, they can do a lot, even they have a three access, uh, job. Milestone two is, uh, how can you make the most out of this, uh, pilot changers on the fire package?

So, you know, our solution is designed to eliminate their time and cost associated with switching different jobs. So this is there, of course, achieved through our tool and the product, but capacity itself has its limit, right? So two flexibility comes from in. Standardization of tools, work holding and the materials under, I think I touched.

[36:00] Liability does matter when you, uh, when you do a, uh, light operation in high mix, high mix, low ender, a high mix, low boarding manufacturing. So, for example, consider a lipid job you run a few weeks or a few months ago if your machine can maintain the same accuracy as when the pot was originally proved out.

You want to keep the setup in the machine, right? So, because once the setup is broken down, you want to evaluate otherwise you’ll be afraid. Uh, anyway. Okay. So the question becomes how many, you might not

Nick Goellner: get the same result Exactly. If you switch, if you change one variable. Right. Thank

Yuto Matsuura: you. So, so the question is, how many setups can you retain in your machine?

So the more. The more path you can learn with the common work holdings and the tools, tools, selections, the higher the number becomes. So when you establish this kind of, uh, standardized environment, every job becomes a bonus. Just load the material, press the button, go home. No need to touch programs offset.

[37:00] I think that’s how you can, you know, make the most out of where our pocket solution under. Again, with product changes, you can easily sweep in one of jobs between regular production without disrupting the flow. So I would say standardization. Is there another milestone you wanna, you wanna look at?

Eric Nekich: Yeah, absolutely.

Outstanding. So I think, you know, I had three questions for you, Yuto. Mm-hmm. And the third one I was gonna ask has been answered two or three times over already. Beautifully. So I’ll stick to just the first two I had. And you know, thinking about. Four generations in a family business is amazing. Uh, do you have a personal vision for Matsuura over the next 10, 20 years?

Oh, should I answer?

Nick Goellner: Please? Do we have to, do we have to sign? Do we have to sign an NA? No, you don’t have to give us proprietary

Yuto Matsuura: info. No,

[38:00] I can answer. So. I think, uh, our, my previous generation from my grand, from my, uh, great-grandfather to my father, they did an incredible job building a relationship with the customers and their partnership. So we are very proud of our sales network and their customer base. Then there, you know, uh, labor shortage is a thing in everywhere.

And of course, this can push ourselves because we offer automation solution, but at the same time, we are also the one who is suffering from a labor shortage. So I, I kind of see, okay, the demand is growing. The problem is how can we maintain it? How can we catch up with the demand? So I think. It would be my responsibility and my mission to think about how we can make our business trustable.

[39:00] So there is a research saying that in Japan we have a 75 million people of workforce currently, but in 10 years we will, we would, would, we could lose 10% of them. So either way, we have to hire 10% people. Uh, we have to keep the people or we have to 10% more efficient. So that’s how we can mm-hmm. Catch up with this, uh, decreasing number of people.

So under. My asset leader, I spent two or three years working on our internal ERP and PM system. That was a really, really hard work. And in the end I found out that, okay, I really need to work on, seriously, it’s not a one shot, it’s going to be five years, 10 years projects. But that gave me a real good understanding of our business, how it works, and what is a challenging point I need to change.

And uh, so that gave me a good sense of, okay. For coming 10 years. I want to work on this. I want to change this so that the goal is this and this and that. So I would say I would like to focus on more internal operation for coming 10 years. Well, it, it does not sound there. How can I say? Exciting. Yeah, that’s it.

That’s great. But that’s my focus.

[40:00] Dave Vuyk: Great. And super, super relevant. You know, just touching on the, the labor shortage issue and just the fact that, you know, everyone needs to be thinking creatively about how to overcome that. Not just to maintain current demand, but to, to provide. Room for growth and, and scaling, uh, as well.

So, yeah,

Eric Nekich: well, well said. And a lot of the conversations we’re having, you know, about automation, there’s symmetry there with ERP and how, like mm-hmm. You know, the business flows from start to finish. So that’s, uh, it’s, it’s extremely topical.

Nick Goellner: Yeah. Completely. And I. It’s an awesome answer because you, you often hear, okay, there’s a labor problem, solve it with automation.

[41:00] And here we have an automation company, a machine tool, a company that specializes in automation, who also has a labor shortage. And you talk to the, the one who will be driving this boat and who’s already starting to drive this boat. And it’s has what, what, what’s your focus for the next 10? Internal processes with your technology, with your ERP and and people.

And so I think that’s telling, you know, the more you grow, even when you’re small, but the more you grow, the more you realize it’s just people who makes the company incredible. Mm-hmm. I’m sorry. And so it’s, and it’s hard to find great people. And so for me, I always make the joke like. Recruiting is a huge part of my job.

Finding the right people who I think are the right fit and have the right culture, and have the right values, and getting them to come work for my business is a huge part of my job.

Yuto Matsuura: Well hear me about it.

Nick Goellner: You know,

Dave Vuyk: sometimes I, uh, I log into LinkedIn in the morning and I swear, like the first 10 posts I see are people talking about how AI is gonna replace so many jobs.

I think to myself, come on down to manufacturing. We got a place for you. Maybe there’s an opportunity there. Who knows?

[42:00] Eric Nekich: So one, I have one last question for you, UTO. Mm-hmm. Um, mm-hmm. You’ve been on this journey for a while now. What are you most proud of?

Yuto Matsuura: So is it my personal history or for entire muscular history? Yeah, I

Eric Nekich: think, I think, uh, you can answer that either way you want. You could even answer it both ways if you want. Um, yeah. Just curious, on this journey so far, what are you most proud of?

Yuto Matsuura: Okay,

Eric Nekich: so,

Yuto Matsuura: okay. I I will, I will, I would like to give you two answers for other company.

[43:00] I think that one of, how can I say, biggest journey for us is there, because there are so many things we did. But I think, uh, my father really worked so hard on their building, uh, dealership sales network and, uh, now we have a very, like a capable group company on the dealership we are so proud of. And, but it, that do not mean that we always had capable team from the beginning, for example.

Mm-hmm. We used to have a manufacturing site in the uk but later we had to close the business. Because we didn’t do good that time and they had, but their UK team have gone their huge transformation and now they’re one of their very capable sales on cyber company and uh, with good reputation. And in the US we had a exclusive importer, uh, dealers with yeah, one of major machine tool distributors and we have a relationship for decades.

We got divorced and we decided, Matura decided to make our own branch company in the US in Minnesota, and that, I think the date of the foundation was April 1st. So many people thought it was a joke, you know, April 4th, and many people say, oh, Matura would not last. But somehow, of course, a big thanks to everyone under my father’s, uh, initiative.

[44:00] Max United States is successful company right now. So, and we have similar stories everywhere. It’s not just about our group companies. I can say the same thing about our dealership, especially in Europe. So we have survived through some tough times and, uh, through this journey we built a great relationship with them.

And, uh, at one exhibition, one of them made a speech about our business and they, they said the relationship with Oz was not just business. And I think this means a lot to us. So building a good partnership leadership, that’s the one major journey we have gone through. And there, okay. My personal one is there.

[45:00] So I, I’ve been, uh, working at Microsoft for seven years, eight years now. So, uh, I think one of the unique achievements where they’re launching our online marketing initiative. So. During the pandemic, I, I established a dedicated team. The trigger came from our international group company. So as, as I said, our build core is a unique point.

We need to, you know, push this, you know, uh, uniqueness in our, uh, online, in marketing under, but that time mm-hmm. To be honest, Moz was a dinosaur when it came to online marketing. We didn’t have any strategy, but now we have a, you know, d center in-house capability to create online content and uh, yeah, and we actively share what we do through videos on social media.

And I think that was a major transformation of our company. And at the same time, it was also life changing experience for me as well. So. Before I took initiative on this project, that was their first two years of my time at Matsuda, and they were the most difficult and the most joyful years in my life because I didn’t lead.

[46:00] I didn’t lead anything. I had no freedom, no responsibility under, I didn’t feel I’ve made a contribution to the business in any meaningful way. So. At one point I asked the managing team that if I could get more involved with their, involved with their HandsOn engineering staff, because that’s my skills and experience.

Before I joined Matsuda, I worked for Lan Japan for three years, so I, I had kind of had a confidence whether robot automation, probably I can make something outta my experience, but I was told to stay focused on a bigger picture. No. Because it will be risky for someone like me who, uh, someone like me to get deeply involved with a specific project because nobody can say no to me.

[47:00] And I kind of felt I had no opportunity to try myself. And, uh, day by day the confidence I worked so hard to build started to fade. So, but eventually I got this opportunity to start something from scratch to try to fail and to prove myself. That’s how I gained my confidence back. So I guess this was the second turning point in my life when the family business became my passion.

And, uh, yeah. So this where there,

Nick Goellner: so it’s interesting. It, it’s connected to marketing. You don’t, yeah. So. You know, we, we had a similar situation at our business where we had virtually 0% of our new opportunities or new projects came in through what we call like inbound marketing. Mm-hmm. You know, somebody finding us online, they were searching for a solution to a problem.

[48:00] They found our company and. Okay. We make, my grandfather invented a machine tool. Mm-hmm. As well. It’s the first circular carbide production saw, so that’s where my focus was when I was young. Anyone searching for high production sawing should visit our website and we had very little, and you know, we sell a lot of tombstones for work, holding for horizontal machines.

We weren’t getting very many opportunities, almost zero from our website. And so. I wasn’t an engineer like you, that was kind of my thing.

Mm-hmm.

Nick Goellner: I read every possible book. I listened to every leader I, I watched all the YouTube I could about how to get people to find you, and that’s when I started to have my own confidence.

We transformed the marketing of the business to where. If you fast forward five years from almost zero, it was like, why do we need all these salespeople, the website’s bringing all the opportunities and mm-hmm. And, and then, you know, the thing with marketing you to, it’s like every two or three years, everything changes again.

[49:00] Mm-hmm. You do a search now and you have artificial intelligence finding you the results instead of traditional search engine optimization. And so it’s this. Fun adventure of trying to chase down how people find you and what you want to be known for. Like you said, you wanted to be known for that incredible precision and build quality.

And it’s one thing for the Matsuro family to know this, or the people who work for Matsuro or the Japanese people, but you need the world to understand it. And I just wanna commend you and say. You’re, you’re having success. You’re on the Lights Out podcast. Thank you.

I just wanna say Uto humbly, this is the third most important turning point of your life, being on

Yuto Matsuura: the Thank you for giving me opportunity.

Nick Goellner: I, no, I’m, I, I’m totally kidding. But that’s a very humble man. Uh, if you haven’t noticed, I, I’m totally kidding. Uh, the, the truth is though, I see what you’re doing on LinkedIn.

[50:00] Dave, Dave Turner works for me. He’s like, Hey, I talked to you, told Mat Surro. I’m like, I want him on my podcast too. So, because you’re putting yourself out there because you’re telling the Mat Surro story. That’s why I reached out to you on LinkedIn and tried to get you on on the podcast so you could share the incredible legacy that your family has built.

So whatever you’re doing, it’s working. It’s one of those things where you don’t see instant results. Mm-hmm. But I, I know you see it, I know. You see that the brand is growing and that, and, and, and you have the hard part figured out. You have an incredible value proposition, an incredible culture, uh, a really good sales network and a brand that people.

Connect to elite manufacturing and automation. So that’s, that’s the hardest part. Now, you just need to get that story out there. So thank you so much for joining us and sharing that story. This has been great.

Eric Nekich: So many good, so many good stories. Thank you so much for your time.

Yuto Matsuura: Oh, I appreciate your time, but

Nick Goellner: you made me cry.

You did make

Eric Nekich: Nick cry, so,

Nick Goellner: so now you owe me a fear. Whatever. We see

[51:00] you, Utah, will you beat at the IMTS next year when you come to the US for the IMTS show?

Yuto Matsuura: Of course, the next year. Awesome.

Nick Goellner: Okay, so can we, will you do this again? Will, will you join us again? Uh, at the next IMTS ’cause we’re gonna have a recording booth in our recording studio in our, uh, trade show booth.

Yuto Matsuura: Okay.

Nick Goellner: Why

Yuto Matsuura: not?

Nick Goellner: Yeah, yeah. Hey, I put, I put you on the spot. We’re recording, so you can’t tell me now.

Yuto Matsuura: Well, I’m looking forward to that. Thank you.

Nick Goellner: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much. Um, have a, have a wonderful tomorrow since you’re already in it. Yeah. Yes. And, uh, and Eric, Dave, thank you so much for, uh, joining me on this episode with the legend Uto Mat.

Yeah,

Dave Vuyk: thank you so much. Judo.

Eric Nekich: Let’s, I think we should close this in Udo’s words of. Load the work piece, push the button and go home to your family. Go home.

Yuto Matsuura: Yeah.

Eric Nekich: Love that.

Yeah. And with that,

[52:00] Yuto Matsuura: okay, let’s turn the lights out. Yeah. Everyone load my tears. Press the button. Let’s go home. Thank you. Yeah,

thank you.

You

Nick Goellner: love it. Thank you so much, man. That’s great.